Tom Torero’s new video product Stealth Seduction just came out this month. I was excited and I bought it. And there is a lot of rich material here. I have studied a lot of Game material in my time, and this is a one of a kind product. I spent the last week going through it. Here’s my review.
“I expanded on the social science theme to Tom.
“Imagine – an anthropologist journeys up the River Amazon in his heavily laden canoe… The anthropologist has just discovered an unknown prehistoric tribe!
“The function of the original ‘Headhunters Of the Amazon’ book is to introduce the tribe to the polite chattering society. But then people say, ‘Hang on. Tell us more about this tribe,’ and the anthropologist, who by now has lived with them for five years, realizes there are more stories to tell.
“I could tell Tom had similar thoughts, if a little less lurid… we absolutely get it, having lived and breathed it for several years… Tom told me he felt like David Attenborough studying endangered species, recording all the knowledge we’d acquired so that future generations could read and study: what we’d experienced, the things we’d created, and the fact that it was all special. We were the guys to document it all.”
— Krauser, from his book Adventure Sex
That is a few lines from Krauser’s last book (which I’m reading now). The “Headhunters Of the Amazon” reference is perhaps a metaphor for Krauser’s initial book Nitro or Tom’s first memoir Daygame. The “more stories to tell” could be Mastery and Torero Travels. As Krauser talks here, the “future generations could read and study” points to Overkill and Stealth Seduction, and everything else they’ve done.
I include this here as this is Krauser in 2014 forecasting these products. But also because the anthropoly reference fits my experience of Stealth Seduction very well.
The “tribe” here is daygame. It’s us. And in this case, Krauser and Tom are studying and documenting themselves, and passing that on in the form of books and videos. So we can study and learn.
So that is what this is, an anthropological body of work. It’s a chance to study and learn from Tom.
And it many ways it’s the most “personal” product I’ve ever seen in Game instruction. It’s almost all POV. There is almost no narration. It is very intimate, so intimate you hear Tom taking a leak several times as he gets the girl back to his place. You really are getting the anthropologists view of “the tribe.” And all that daygame “cultural” experience and documentation.
“This is the world’s most comprehensive daygame, dating and pickup product that is 100% infield. There’s no longwinded seminar or waffling video breakdowns as filler. It’s as pure as it gets.”
— Tom Torero
It’s mostly audio, in the form of video clips, but often the video goes black and you just hear the sound. Tom has overlaid words on the video, to point out what he’s doing, because again, this is not a seminar. This is not a “video breakdown” like you’ve seen Krauser do in Overkill or like the Daygame.com guys did with their infields. It’s different.
The series is broken up into infields. The “Lay Infields” — that lead to sex, and you see (or rather, hear) the entire process. And then, some shorter “Infields” that don’t culminate in a notch. Overall, you have hours and hours and hours of barely edited contact with girls. From pickup to date to bedroom. If you like details, and the “whole story,” you’ll love this series.
For reference, if you’d ever seen Tom’s Girlfriend Sequence, you’ll find the flow somewhat familiar. It’s the sequence itself, raw, all footage, no seminar. It’s like you’re in his lap as he goes through his own model.
There is a lot to learn here. And it’s gross at times. But let’s move on.
IS THIS ABOUT DAYGAME?:
This is Tom Torero, and that makes me think daygame. But I would say this not a daygame product. If you are interested in daygame specifically, there are better sources. Tom is a world class daygamer. And you see it here, but that is not the focus of this product. Daygame is a very small percentage of what this product has to offer.
The daygame you do see feels “old school,” in terms of the opening couple of lines (only). “Can I say something to you quickly?” I’m not saying it is bad game at all (no one ever looks “French”), but it’s *the* formula the Daygame.com guys taught in terms of opening, etc, as Tom was one of *the* guys that taught it. I studied all that stuff. And now I purposely try to never sound like that. It’s simple, and is clearly effective, and Tom is varied and can improvise… but you won’t be impressed with the daygame itself.
And some lay reports don’t show the pickup at all.
THIS IS ABOUT ESCALATION:
This is product about escalation. This is a series of escalations… both over the course of the “relationship,” and at a micro-level. From the widest part of the funnel, the part on the street, to the text game, to the initial date (if it wasn’t an immediate pull), to the sex. You see it over and over.
He shows you a roadmap, almost like a dash-cam of the road, actually. And if I was a beginner, I bet it would be scary, as it’s hard and detailed and complicated. For intermediate and advanced guys, it’s valuable to have all this normalized by watching another guy do it… we already know it’s hard and complicated, so that’s not a big deal. For me, it was more about seeing what is possible, and comparing to things I have done, have almost done, or would like to do. In that space, it was invaluable. No one has done this before.
If you’re a beginner… if you haven’t taken many women thru this model, especially if you haven’t had a lot of girlfriends or sex, you might get a lot out of that part. Like the specific steps from the front door to your notch. “I put her hand on my dick,” etc. Very specific. Again, just like Girlfriend Sequence, it’s “step by step,” but he doesn’t really spell it out, you just hear it happen. The product comes with a PDF that lays out the steps, but that’s not the interesting part of this work.
” This is the product I wish had existed eight years ago when I started on my pickup journey.
THIS IS ABOUT REFERENCE EXPERIENCES:
This product is about escalation, and knowing what that is like… aka, references experiences. That is the juice of the product, I think. You are getting Tom’s reference experiences, almost first hand. That is what you’re paying for. I know how much knowledge I have assimilated on my journey from pros like Tom. From watching them work and internalizing not just their moves, or lines, but their attitudes. Lance Mason from Pickup 101. Julian from RSD. Paul Janka. Braddock from LvS. Sinn (I still love Sinn, read something on his old blog this morning). Definitely Krauser. And Tom. I’ve learn from all of them.
And there is a lot of repetition. The same stories. The same lines. Which is good, as some of that will be drilled into you if you go through enough of Tom’s examples.
So in this case, the product was perfect for me. For where I am at in Game.
I bet this *is* the product Tom wished he had. But remember that Tom is an Oxford grad. A very smart guy. Presumably studious. If you’re a smash and grab type of player, and you’re used to 5 minute pickup infields… I can’t imagine you having the patience to sit through all this. Or much of it at all.
You will have to be pretty dedicated to get at the bulk of what this series has to offer.
Let’s go thru some examples and I’ll show you what I mean.
“16 nationalities of girls (including British, American, Canadian, Japanese, German, French, Polish, Singaporean, Moldovan, Spanish, Egyptian, Ukrainian, South African, Russian, Colombian and Iranian”
ENGLISH DOCTOR (Lay Report):
I’ll start with a fun one. She is a married British girl, just becoming a doctor. It’s a great
clip video and you get see a guy that is very good with girls take a warm lead “all the way” through to sex. She is an interesting girl, very smart and charming, and also a bit filthy at times (and I like that about her). It is truly an anthropological experience to listen to her and Tom game each other. The banter, from both of them, is excellent. Tom is very on, and looks great here. Entertaining and you might learn something. I took notes about his text game and the techniques he uses to disarm the LMR before he closes this girl. The video is 43:00 minutes long.
And let’s talk about that 43:00 minutes bit. That is a long video.
I know somewhere I once heard a long audio of Tom and some girl that he fucks in a bathroom, mid date. And it was, in my opinion, hard to study. I’m not the slightest bit lazy, but that is a long time to sit around and listen to chit-chat, trying to learn something. If you do make it through the long, ambling chatter, you will very likely learn. But like I said, it’s going to take discipline.
This is very much like anthropological work… much of which can be boring. Wading thru the details, like sifting through the WikiLeaks stuff to witness the douchebaggary of Hillary Clinton and the DNC. It’s in there, and it’s douchey, but you have to look for it. Patient work.
For this example, there is no video at all… it’s blackscreen, with a lot of the conversation running like subtitles so you can get it even when it gets a bit mumbley. It’s just them on a date. They aren’t on stage and don’t act like it. So you get the transcription, and some extra notes from Tom… but you have to stare at the screen for 43:00 minutes.
His PDF will give you some highlights, but I don’t think you’ll learn much from that. So if you want the lessons to be learned, you have to sit through it, patiently, like a grad student and paw through the hours. This one is easy, but they aren’t all so easy to digest.
MOLDOVAN PARK PULL (Lay Report):
The footage here is also very educational. I learned a lot from it, this might be the most important one, in terms of what I learned.
This girl is a princess, almost cool, but a bitch on wheels. She is a hot chick, and she knows it. And Tom is really excellent here as he works thru that and closes her. He is genuinely amazing in this video, as she is a very difficult girl to handle and you can see Tom’s experience. You will see push/pull (what Tom calls “on/off”) demonstrated at the expert level. He slowly crushes her princess shit, chops her down to size in a way that makes her like him, and you can see it happen in what feels like real time. It is convincing. He also destroys the BF, as she is attached. He’s tactical there. You see it all.
And this one has video for parts of it (I think it’s some of the only video that isn’t POV, don’t know how he did that). But it is 1:38:00 minutes long. You will learn, if you sit still, and stare at a blackscreen for most of that time, pay attention to what you see/hear, and maybe take something from his notes as well (which are not that complicated).
I will say that like most video/audio I study, I do this while I am working on my client business. I can do my day job, and let this play in the background, and jump back/forth to get the interesting points, including much, but certainly not all of the notes. 1:38:00 minutes… that’s a lot of time. And that is 1 of 13 infields, in the lay section alone. A fraction of the content here. A lot of time.
This is expert stuff, but you need to be a real student to get it. For this one, I think a beginner would be bored or over his head. For me, it was exactly what I need (and by that, I mean this specific clip). I’m well into my game. I can pickup and date and close. I am already comfortable with that process. This was a chance for me to see a guy with much more experience than me do it, in a very difficult situation. I could not have gamed this girl. Not because she is hot, and she is. But because she is fucking hard.
Seeing Tom do this here showed me a lot. I’m not that far away from being able to game girls like this. Again, Tom’s references experiences will help me along.
19 YEAR OLD SDL2 (Lay Report):
Okay, so this is the other end of the spectrum. She is young, and fucking hot, and Tom sexes her, and you get every detail of it. And… it is 50:00 minutes long. And it is… inane to listen too. Completely painful. She is a nice girl, but she is young, silly, her English is terrible, and you have to listen to Tom baby talk her for the whole video, with her goofy giggle and a black screen to keep you company.
To be real, I hated these videos. I still learned from them, but they were a punishment to sit through. Proof of my willingness to learn and my wanting to do a good job on this review. Again, you will learn… but you’ll likely hate the time you spend doing it. And you’ll be so glad when these clips are over. I almost hate this girl, it was so hard to listen to her giggle. Sorry babe, but fuck you and your dumbass giggle.
The Polish Virgin is like this too, a similar clip. Her, on an insta-date, giggling. For 1:03:00 minutes. Brutally dull “research” to be done if you want to learn from this. And you will learn, but you will pay for the knowledge.
TOM IS GREAT AT TEXT GAME:
Before I go further, I want to stop and talk about Tom’s text game. It’s very, very good. You see many examples, woven into the flow from daygame approach to date. Like the Polish Virgin I mention above… I hated that clip, but the text was very good, and not quite, but almost worth my time.
You see Tom ping girls in the morning. You see him spin plates and recover from fucked logistics. It’s good. I am at a stage in my game, dating a lot of girls, and I need more mentoring here. If you are at or below my level, and can sit through this content, I think you’ll really get something from the text examples. I am okay with text, but Tom is much better. And he happens to have a similar style of game to me (not super alpha dude, really), so he’s a great teacher for my style of game.
My cousin is 18. He just started college. A month or so ago, one of his roommates got a girlfriend. And the roommate and the new girlfriend never leave the room. They just sit around, and goo-goo talk each other, and my poor cousin had to listen to it, and it drove him mad. And I don’t blame him. You see where I’m going here?
An important distinction here is when the girls can speak English well vs when they cannot — like the Japanese girl, or Vancouver Gutter Girl, the even the 18 Year Old Ukrainian. Because of the language barrier, much of Tom’s charm is limited to simple concepts. Tom doing hours of monosyllabic, 3 word sentences, running the Strawberry Fields routine like you would on a four year old. To be a fly on the wall for that kind of date is something I think few men can enjoy. It was sickening for me, many times.
To be fair, Tom is actually there. So he gets so see her eyes sparkle, and smell her, to enjoy her soft skin, and eventually fuck these girls. It’s very different for him. For us on this end, it is dry fucking toast indeed. While it was pure torture to listen to those particular sets, I do recognize what he was doing. He had the pleasure of their company, and I did not, so he can have a good time in that situation, where I was about to slit my wrists.
WE’VE ALL BEEN THERE:
In Tom’s defense, I have been gaming Japanese girls, and I’m sure my dates would be insultingly dumb to listen to. I am in Tokyo as I write this. I’ve had 5 dates in two weeks with girls that speak low- to limited English. And many dozen street approaches that were similarly baby-talk stupid. It’s not the player. Or the girl (okay, sometimes it’s the girl), it’s the language barrier.
And while I want to hate Tom for making me listen to this stuff, as I have been on my own dates I hear myself sounding a lot like him. Not because I’m copying what he is doing (although I have already started to use some of what I’ve learned). I sound like him, because this is what dates with young girls that don’t speak your language sound like. Everyone sounds a bit retarded. I know these dates can be hot when you’re there… but they are terrible to sort through.
MANY GOOD ONES:
You are saved from time to time with other sets. The Vegas Girl is so fun (the banter there is truly excellent, great to go through that one), excellent opportunity to learn and fun as well. While the Canadian girl is disgusting, the Cheerleader is great. And the NYU College student is charming, Tom shows good skill there. Those clips are both about an hour each, but they read like fiction compared to the non-English girls.
A BETTER FORMAT?:
” There’s no woo-woo “self-help” mental masturbation here.”
No, there isn’t. But to be honest, I liked Badass Buddha much more. I know Tom is trying to do something different here, but there is nothing wrong with the seminar format. It’s palatable and holds your attention. I think Krauser has the formula right with his recent videos, again Overkill, and even Black Book. Maybe the right answer is a mix of that format, with more samples of the audio, and then break to analysis and point to what is happening… and skip the hours of mindless small talk and most of the comfort building… or offer that as reference only.
I like how Krauser does notes on infield breakdowns on his blog, where he shows the timecode, then the comment. That would make all this much more interesting… to get it side by side, and edited, so you don’t have to sort thru the mindnumbing stuff.
And while that won’t give you the very useful experience of hearing how to fill time, and blab about nothing for an hour… I think the average person will learn more.
PROBLEM WITH POV:
Another thing I’d add, is the POV also holds this product back.
“Friday afternoon would be one the few days Tom and I winged together. He prefers going solo, which disappointed me because I like the social vibe with a wing and Tom makes a very good partner.”
— Krauser, also from Adventure Sex
Unlike almost any product you’ve ever seen, Tom films/records all this himself. Which is interesting, but like a lot of the Youtube stuff we’ve seen. And you don’t get to see him and the girls interaction that much, not from a 3rd party perspective. And her face is blurred, so you miss much of her as well. That doesn’t leave you with much visually. You don’t get the body language. The Daygame.com products were more and more about nice, clear, highend video. And that brought a lot of non-verbal detail into the instruction. This is almost all audio, which makes it less entertaining, and less rich.
Perhaps Tom’s interest in going solo — and I recognize the freedom there, at many levels — is behind some of that.
TOM IS A GREAT SEDUCER OF WOMEN:
As I wrap this up, I want to give Tom props for being a chameleon — which is to say, a great seducer of women. He can calibrate to so many different types of girls, and close them, it’s obvious he has tremendous skill. He can talk baby talk to FSU girls with poor English, or rattle along with the snappy Doctor. I learned from him.
“I hope it’s the “missing piece of the puzzle” for you.”
I think intermediate guys can take a lot away from this series. Again, it was perfect for me. You’ll get little bits, here and there. You’ll see well-timed DHVs and IODs. You’ll pick up lines that will add “1%” to your game — but the 1% that might get you laid when you really need it. Like a key to specific lock you have maybe seen before but will likely see again.
This was vulnerable stuff, and you did a good job. I think you clearly succeeded in what you wanted to do.
I’m sure I’ll absorb some of what I saw and heard here, and it will become part of my working vocabulary of game. But unlike a lot of other products, I know I will not watch/listen to these again (maybe that Moldovan one… amazing example there, or the Vegas one, which was great). No way I would do that to myself for most of those clips. Whereas I have listened to No Drama Dating by Lance Mason maybe four times (and learn more each time). Fader’s from LoveSystmes talk on “frames” I have listened to over 10 times. Jason Savage’s T21C talk from Stockholm is on heavy rotation for me (it’s on YouTube, go watch it now). And even Badass Buddha… I’ve watched that series maybe three times.
This one, no way.
In many ways, I think this product is much more unique, and fills a special gap in the instruction of Game, but it is not for everyone.
“Stealth Seduction is the infield companion to my textbook Street Hustle…
With all that said, I also own a hardcopy of Tom’s textbook Street Hustle. And I haven’t read it yet. I’ll get into it when I get back to the States. And I am really looking fwd to that book, even though this series clearly wore me out. And I highly recommend both of Tom’s softbacks, which I also own, and reference several times on this site. Those books truly inspired me when I got started, and they were fun, and a pleasure to read.
Cool. Thanks Tom, for all the instruction. You’re a genius, and I owe you much in terms of direct lessons and inspiration. My game wouldn’t be the same without you.